(no subject)

[camwyn]

So.

New York City's gonna do random searches of people's bags if they wanna get on the subway and 'people who don't want to be searched are perfectly free to turn around and leave the station'.

Show of hands- do I start carrying a bag full of mousetraps, or should I start carrying a bag full of some formulation of Play-Doh that feels like dog crap if a cop puts his hand on it? Not that I dislike the members of the NYPD; I'm very fond of cops in general. But since the city doesn't seem to think that the Constitution matters any more (small surprise, since Washington doesn't either)- or that this constitutes a reasonable search and seizure- I'd like to make it plain that if you're going to search me, ever, you are going to have to pay for that privilege.

I'm thinkin' the play-doh. Or a can of non-dairy creamer with a lid that comes off easily- no, then they'd go "ACK ANTHRAX" and I'd be late for work. But you get the idea.

Suggestions?

Comments

[camwyn]

It's the reasonable part that bothers me. "Hi there! We don't know who you are and we don't care, but we're going to presume that you're doing or carrying something that indicates criminality. Show us your stuff. Now. Or go away. Oh, you use the subway to go to work? Too bad, bitch. You should've opened up for us. You must be some kind of criminal or pervert or terrorist or something and you aren't entitled to use the subway if you aren't willing to have us go through your stuff."

I pay $2 for a train ride- less, actually, since I usually buy monthly passes. It's public transportation. It's a substitute for my car. I shouldn't be turned away from public transportation because I want to maintain some modicum of privacy, unless there's a really good reason for them to suspect that something big and ugly is impending. The curtailment of free speech in the event that it creates a clear and present danger is reasonable; the curtailment of free speech in cases where there might be a danger is not. Same here.

Besides, I have no faith that this is going to make anything any safer. Unless they search everybody, they're going to miss somebody- they miss them on airplanes and they have far fewer people to search. So they're basically conducting a search for no good reason to no good effect.

[zsero.livejournal.com]

If it depends on consent, it doesn't have to be reasonable. Reasonableness, consent, and a warrant; you only need one to justify a search.

And no, the search doesn't mean "we're going to presume that you're doing or carrying something that indicates criminality", any more than does the security search when getting on a plane, or the customs search when getting off. There's no presumption of guilt; what they're saying is that "we're almost certain you're not carrying anything you shouldn't be, but we can't be 100% sure, and the combined burden on all the innocent people we search is smaller than the harm that will be done if we don't find the one person who is carrying a bomb or something".

In any case, I think the constitutional test of reasonableness depends on the nature of the search, and the general circumstances, rather than any suspicion they may have of you in particular.

And no, you aren't entitled to use the subway. It's private property (well, government property), and the MTA is entitled to exclude anyone whom the law allows it to exclude. That's why it can exclude you if don't consent to pay your $2; and by the same logic it can exclude you if you don't consent to a search of your bag, or any other condition the Powers That Be decide is appropriate to impose. (Except that, as a government entity, they can't be completely arbitrary, or discriminate against particular viewpoints; so they can ban all T-shirts, if they come up with a plausible justification, but they can't ban only T-shirts with particular words printed on them, while allowing shirts that are identical except for not having have those words.)

I agree that it's probably not going to make anyone safer, and is therefore not only a massive inconvenience but also a waste of police resources. But that's the NYPD's and MTA's decision to make, not mine or yours.